Pushbike Boxes - Lanesplitting is fine....

[Glen]

For those in New South bloody Wales on the news this morning.

Some loophead is suggesting that the RTA put in Pushbike Boxes at the front of one lane at traffic lights. This will allow pushies to Lanesplit through traffic and plonk themselves in their special box at the front of the traffic. They can then take off at 10km/h and risk death by getting overtaken by the pissed off vehicles who have now struggled to get past them numerous times on the one stretch of road. All the while if you try the same manouvre on your motorised bicycle you will continue to be fined........Sheesh.

So lane splitting is obviously perilous for motorcycles while being perfectly safe for bicycles. Is there something I'm missing?

[Colette]

I've never heard of these...I have this mental image of them being like the stalls that horses come out of on a racetrack

[Duane]

painted boxes infront of traffic... we've got them in vic, have had them for a long time

[Stereo]

painted boxes infront of traffic... we've got them in vic, have had them for a long time

Yeah, they are brilliant! I use them all the time.... as does every motorcyclist in Melbourne...

Support them 100%

[smek]

Especially useful if there's a motorcycle lane leading to them.

In reality the cyclists are going to do the same thing if they are there or not, having the boxes there just legitamises the whole thing and hopefully stops those in cars getting shitty because the cyclists are no longer breaking the law.
As long as the cyclists take off before the light turns green to get a bit of a head start it doesn't make much difference. If the road is too skinny it's going to be a bitch constantly overtaking the same cyclists over and over again. Because he is going to lane split past you over and over again no matter if there's a painted box on the road or not.

[hoffy]

If I was on a pushy, i'd rather be behind cars than having them try to pass me at the traffic light drags.

What left wing tree hugger came up with that idea?

[Glen]

If I was on a pushy, i'd rather be behind cars than having them try to pass me at the traffic light drags.

What left wing tree hugger came up with that idea?

Greg Delmos of the National Transport Council. Weren't these the clowns who put up the ban on lane splitting? Maybe this will be a good thing if they can be convinced that it would also be safer for motorcyclists to be allowed to do this.

Motorcycle Council delegates, off you go.

[MadKaw]

From th MCC of NSW

The following link is to the National Transport Council website

NTC Road Rules changes proposal

http://www.ntc.gov.au/NewsDetail.aspx?p ... 0002000208

The proposed changes primarily concern Advanced Stop Lines (international
term) now known here as "Bicycle Storage Boxes"

In my view, this is a good thing and should be supported "in principle", but
we need to examine the Rules carefully and determine any adverse effects
upon motorcycles.

In the longer term view, we need to work to bring together the similarities
in behaviour of single track vehicles in slow moving traffic. With those, we
need to be able to show the benefits of "shared space".

Allowing bicycles to break the ground for us is OK, as long as we are quick
to plant the right seeds and tend the ideas carefully, growing them into
reality.

Ideally, Rules for bicycles and motorcycles would be almost the same for low
speed traffic situations. We want to be able to share the storage boxes and
have no legal problems to get there by lane filtering.

There is a plethora of bicycle track for off-road use as shared space with
pedestrian traffic.
I do not propose to even look at that.

However, there are large parts of the roadway area that have been reserved
for exclusive use by bicycles.
We need to draft guidelines or "rules" that would allow these (mostly unused
and empty) bicycle paths to be shared by motorcycles legally.

This is about "Sharing the Road"

This is in concert with obtaining similar exemptions to Rule 90 (breakdown
lane use) and Rule 141 (overtake either side) under specific conditions:-

(1) low differential speed (less than 30 km/hr differential in any case) of
overtaking vehicle (bicycle or motorcycle)
(2) traffic is moving below 30km/hr in case of Rule 90
(3) traffic is stationary in case of Rule 141

Earlier submissions on lane splitting are available from
http://www.mccofnsw.org.au/a/166.html
and
http://mraa.org.au/forum/modules/issues ... ?pagenum=3

This is a significant issue of interest for NSW.

Please discuss.

Guy Stanford
Chairman
Motorcycle Council of NSW



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Some car drivers object to bicycles or motorcycles advancing to the head of
the line of traffic and demand to know why riders of either should have
permission to do this. They see single-track vehicles as unfair
"queue-jumpers".

I ask drivers if they enjoy having to plod along slowly behind a bicycle
pedalling slowly uphill.
No, they don't and they often insist that bicycles have no right to the
road. Bus drivers hate this too. I have seen lines of buses full of
commuters in single-file behind a single bicycle rider, destroying
timetables and creating congestion. This is not reasonable, yet bicycle
riders wish to assert their right to the road and see this as "sharing the
road" - a view I have some difficulty in accepting.

However, we need to separate these things into "high-speed section" and
"low-speed section" situations. The "high-speed" issues are the ones that
infuriate car and bus drivers and are NOT dealt with by bicycle boxes at
intersections, but "low-speed" ones are.

The "low-speed" situation is best defined as "below the speed at which a
bicycle can overtake a car in traffic".

Most bicycle riders are ordinary people, not athletes capable of pedalling
uphill at 60km/hr. My observations is that terrain generally limits them to
around 30-40 km/hr at best.

Below this speed, bicycles and motorcycles exhibit remarkably similar
behaviour, for almost exactly the same reasons, so there is good reason to
align ourselves for these situations and discard the "high-speed" issues for
discussion elsewhere.

Car drivers complain that after having overtaken a pushbike, they have to do
it again and again, as the bicycle lane-splits past them and takes off
slowly from lights. Car drivers claim this causes congestion.

Motorcycle riders do not create this problem, as they accelerate away
cleanly, unless they are 50cc scooters going steeply uphill.

We have to be careful to not indulge in "me-ism" and a reluctance to share
the road. Help them enjoy your presence, they can be allies.

e.g. it is poor practice for motorcycle riders to "buzz" bicycle riders,
close and fast.

We need to work on a "code of practice" that allows a fair set of "rules"
for sharing the road in a way that works for all.
There will be sitations where we decide it is preferred to allow car or
bicycle right of way for flow and/or safety reasons.

By raising lane-filtering awareness of car drivers, it will improve safety
for both bicycles and motorcycles. There is some anecdotal indication that
Motorcycle Awareness improves safety for bicycle riders too, as it is
helping make car drivers more aware of vehicles other than cars.

[Glen]

Motorcycle riders do not create this problem, as they accelerate away
cleanly, unless they are riding a ZX12 sports-tourer.

So the word is out there......

[Colette]

Motorcycle riders do not create this problem, as they accelerate away
cleanly, unless they are riding a ZX12 sports-tourer.

So the word is out there......

Glen, you're on a roll today mate!

[mick_dundee]

In reality the cyclists are going to do the same thing if they are there or not, having the boxes there just legitamises the whole thing and hopefully stops those in cars getting shitty because the cyclists are no longer breaking the law.
As long as the cyclists take off before the light turns green to get a bit of a head start it doesn't make much difference.

I may well be reading this wrong Nikos but I have a funny feelijng that taking off before the light is green is basically running a red light which last i heard was illegal....

[smek]

Yes but the majority of commuting cyclists do this and it is the most sensible/safe option.

[hoffy]

Motorcycle riders do not create this problem, as they accelerate away
cleanly, unless they are riding a ZX12 sports-tourer.

So the word is out there......

ha ha, the footboards can fold up you know

[Glen]

Motorcycle riders do not create this problem, as they accelerate away
cleanly, unless they are riding a ZX12 sports-tourer.

So the word is out there......

Glen, you're on a roll today mate!

Too many red cordials I think.

[Glen]

Motorcycle riders do not create this problem, as they accelerate away
cleanly, unless they are riding a ZX12 sports-tourer.

So the word is out there......

ha ha, the footboards can fold up you know

You got the tassled panniers yet?