Do you own it if it's not 100% paid off?

[SenNey]

but lets humor ur argument for a second.
if i rewrite my home loan to buy a new bike, do i own the bike???
really the only debt i have is a HL and that is less than the value of my home, so even though i borrowed money to buy the bike, i own it outright.

end of rant,
i'm with you on this one too jason

IME no you wouldn't own the bike becuase you still owe the mortgage the extra $$ associated with it.
BUT you would be free to sell it, as it wouldn't be secured in the loan.

[SenNey]

If it's a unsecured personal loan, then you do own it, the money is not against the item you bought.

If its financed, then no, it's not yours, however

You actually do own these items

The house is in your name (deed, hence you own it) even though you got a morgage for it.

So it's a bit grey, but you do own these items you're just still paying for them

How do you own it if it's not paid for?? Thats the big question.
You may have it in your psossesion, but it's not paid for.

Example
You buy a bike for $15,000
You pay of $5000 You only own $5000 of that bike.
You still have another $10,000 to pay of before you own it 100%

[mike-s]

Hence i used to joke for the first 6 months i had my car that i only owned the steering wheel.

[Duane]

If it's a unsecured personal loan, then you do own it, the money is not against the item you bought.

If its financed, then no, it's not yours, however

You actually do own these items

The house is in your name (deed, hence you own it) even though you got a morgage for it.

So it's a bit grey, but you do own these items you're just still paying for them

How do you own it if it's not paid for?? Thats the big question.
You may have it in your psossesion, but it's not paid for.

Example
You buy a bike for $15,000
You pay of $5000 You only own $5000 of that bike.
You still have another $10,000 to pay of before you own it 100%

No i disagree, unless the bike is under finance.

You give the bikeshop a bank check from Commonwealth bank (for example)

That bike is urs.

But the debt is also yours

If the bikes actually under secured finance, it's technically owned by the finance company. (seeing you cant sell it etc)

Basically, at the end of the day, your mate has the right to brag about what he owns, as i'm sure he's working fkn hard to pay his debts off.

If you dont like the fact that someone owns all that stuff and brags about it, get over it.

and for the "how do you own it if it's not paid for" comment, it is paid for, no difference than buying a packet of fags on your credit card, you smoke the smokes because they're yours. however, you owe the bank for 11 bucks. they dont care what it was for, as long as you pay that debt. - so, if you didnt pay that debt, are they going to take your smokes back off you???

[mike-s]

unsecured loan = its yours, but you also have a big fat debt unrelated to the object in question, so you could spend the unsecured 5k on smack, smokes, a car or getting a lapdance a night for 3 months.

However a secured loan, its for a tangible object that is yours by rights. But you've also signed an agreement that legally allows the loan company to relieve you of your ownership if you breech a certain set of conditions, i.e. failure to meet payment.

[SenNey]

Basically, at the end of the day, your mate has the right to brag about what he owns, as i'm sure he's working fkn hard to pay his debts off.

yep he is a sucker, works 60+ hours a week and still can't find two gold coins to rub together

If you dont like the fact that someone owns all that stuff and brags about it, get over it.

It's not about what he does or doesn't have. I coundn't care less. Its about the wanker being a prick to his younger brother.

and for the "how do you own it if it's not paid for" comment, it is paid for, no difference than buying a packet of fags on your credit card, you smoke the smokes because they're yours. however, you owe the bank for 11 bucks. they dont care what it was for, as long as you pay that debt. - so, if you didnt pay that debt, are they going to take your smokes back off you???

I still see CC as you don't own it. You still have the debt for the item, even thou you have it in your possession.
They may not take your smokes, but they will pursue you in other ways to reclaim there "smokes"

[Duane]

I still see CC as you don't own it. You still have the debt for the item, even thou you have it in your possession.
They may not take your smokes, but they will pursue you in other ways to reclaim there "smokes"

Like taking your car, that you dont have a loan for.

So do you really ever own anything??????

Oh no, the paranoia, my worlds closing in on me!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!

[SenNey]

I still see CC as you don't own it. You still have the debt for the item, even thou you have it in your possession.
They may not take your smokes, but they will pursue you in other ways to reclaim there "smokes"

Like taking your car, that you dont have a loan for.

So do you really ever own anything??????

Oh no, the paranoia, my worlds closing in on me!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!

Im not sure if they could take your car, but im sure they do do other things to retreive the money that is owed.

I pay cash for everything, i don't like credit cards, nor loans.
I do have a home loan, thats it No CC or anything else.
( Iv'e seen it get out of control in mates when younger )

I Pay cash for everything, Just ask the poor guy at Brighton Kawasaki who had to count out 12k for a bike.

Credit can be good for some people.
Like those ones who get interest free periods. If they pay it off in time, it's worked in there favour. If not there screwed.


Each to there own

[Duane]

I still see CC as you don't own it. You still have the debt for the item, even thou you have it in your possession.
They may not take your smokes, but they will pursue you in other ways to reclaim there "smokes"

Like taking your car, that you dont have a loan for.

So do you really ever own anything??????

Oh no, the paranoia, my worlds closing in on me!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!

Im not sure if they could take your car, but im sure they do do other things to retreive the money that is owed.

I pay cash for everything, i don't like credit cards, nor loans.
I do have a home loan, thats it No CC or anything else.
( Iv'e seen it get out of control in mates when younger )

I Pay cash for everything, Just ask the poor guy at Brighton Kawasaki who had to count out 12k for a bike.

Credit can be good for some people.
Like those ones who get interest free periods. If they pay it off in time, it's worked in there favour. If not there screwed.


Each to there own

I have debt for things that I OWN and have OWNED. I also use interest free periods and pay them off before they incur interest.

OH and as far as i believe, the bank can repossess whatever they want to recover debt from you, but it's a fairly lengthy process to do so. FYI even if you own your own car outright they can take it from you

[Stereo]

What I want to know is....

Why the fuck do you people care what other people are doing? You've got your own life to live, so live it...

I so fucking agree

Im with stupids....

[mrmina]

Each to there own

correct.

now stop ur .... whatever u were doing

[SenNey]

Each to there own

correct.

now stop ur .... whatever u were doing

But i working i promise.
It's stocktake time!!!
Iv'e got the kids spending the last day os school holidays counting it for me

[chameleon]

Just a word to those that think they own their own home, simply because they have paid off the debt and now hold the mortguage. You Don't!

Now I own my bike, I can be destitute and eating scraps from bins and no one can take it off me. But not so with a home. You fall behind on the "rates" and the council will take it off you and sell it. Now consider you own a home in the bush, miles from anywhere, no power or sewage or water, no wheelie bin. You still have to pay rates to a local council, and they will still take your home if you fall behind on this "Land Rental" tax. I know it's a fine point, but it's true! No one actually owns the land they 'think' they buy, they are merely renting it off the government.

For a suburban house here you can pay around $3000/year land rental. Or $150 000 over a 50 year period. That's a lot of money for emptying the wheelie bin and piping the sewage away hey! Admittedly we recieve other services but mostly we pay for these now, either directly, "water", or indirectly, rego to resurface roads out front of our homes. It's a scam! Or a con game if you like.

The phrase "Owning your own home" is a misnomer, it's like credit card / debit card, both mean the exact opposite but the terms are introduced into society and most people use them and feel good about them... Except once a month... when they open the CC statement.

[diesel]

Senney,
this guy sounds like an absolute toss, if he takes so much pleasure in his posessions, that is.

I work in the finance industry and if a legal transaction has taken place, you own the goods. no matter how much money you owe for it.

now how do you attribute any debt you have to any one thing.
basic economics, opportunity cost. if i have $500 to spend on either new rearsets or a new helmet and i choose to buy the helmet, the cost of the purchase is not only the $500 i spent, but the opportunity to buy the rearsets as well. to counter this, i borrow another $500 and buy both. (opportunity cost equals every dollar you have ever spent but we won't go further down that path) so i've spent $1000, bought a new helmet and rearsets and i have a $500 debt. assuming i bought both at the same time (so not one came before the other) my question to you senney is which do i "own" and which do i not?

now apply this to your current situation, if you have any debt, even a home loan, how do you attribute that debt to any one thing.
because of opportunity cost, the only way you could own everything you have is to be debt free (according to your definition of owning an asset). If you had never bought anything in your life, you may have had enough money to buy a house for cash (example only, i don't know ur situation).
so the aim is to be debt free. but that's impossible. because you'll always have the debt of opportunity cost, every dollar you spend could be spent in another way. so to be truly debt free is to never spend or earn a dollar in your entire life. but then that's a simple way of looking at it as opportunity cost applies to everything, not just money, for example, time.

Now i'm not haveing a go at you, just trying to give you another way of looking at things. your thoughts on debts versus assets is very popular, but also very old school. i don't want you to change your view but only consider the deeper picture. at very least, i hope you find this interesting.

[tape]

It all belongs to me, me, I tell ya....

You will all give your worldly possessions to me and I shall rule the world.

That is if Stuey doesn't beat me to it and kill me first.

CHEERS