What are your views?

[MadKaw]

After the Easter road toll, there is now a call for speed limiters to be installed on all vehicles. Paul Gibson (staysafe chairman) and quite a few other pollies are, again, calling for all vehicles to be limited to 120kph...

I'm not sure how this is going to help as I'm sure the majority of fatalities were not caused by ppl going over 120kph. You can die doing 60....
Another knee jerk reaction to a couple of ppl caught doing ridiculous speeds....

My opinoin, make rider training and track days more affordable.
Have track days incorporate additional training. (they use to).
Have them subsidided by the Govn't not run by a high profit motivated organisation.
The NSW govn't own Eastern Creek raceway and they lease the track out to a single track day / training operator who was the highest bidder for the tender. Its obviously about profit not rider education...
They've even made it so there is no competion to keep prices down..

[Felix]

i'm 21.
and IMO a zxr250 is ultra fast. well it felt like it was when i first got on it.

don't generalise that all younguns are stupid and will kill 'emselves. that's what i'm sayin. base the licenses on aquired skills tests.

*Yawn*

Mate, the stats show people under 25, esp males, take stoopid risks, not just riding/driving, but in general. I was 21 once too. Even though I "thought" I was sensible at the time, yadda yadda yadda, I think I have come a long way, especially in the last few years.

It's not a personal attack on you, but I've been there, done that...and I know I was a lot different to most of my friends who'd race each other and do stoopid stuff...easily influenced as most younger people are by peer pressure, etc...I did my own thing, but I was one out of several.

At the end of the day, if you aren't prepared to make concessions, then you better get used to having the gvmt make all the decisions for you.

[Felix]

Paul Gibson (staysafe chairman) and quite a few other pollies are, again, calling for all vehicles to be limited to 120kph...

How stupid is that? 120kph in a 40 zone is still 80km/h over the limit! What a tool...

The thing is, they will do something like this, and it still wont make a difference...

[MickLC]

21 year olds can get themselves into trouble on scooters from what I hear

[Glen]

I really don't think anyone can know the correct answer to this one because your dealing with human beings who, god bless us all, are entirely different from each other.

Felix's view that it is attitude more so than skill is dead right. An 18yo can punt around on a ZX10 and not get killed if they've got the right attitude. Unfortunately the majority won't have had the time or experience necessary to develop the attitude, which unfortunately comes from close calls and getting yourself outta the shit. Is a smaller capacity bike for a longer peiod going to help this development? Perhaps, but probably not.

I would generally advocate a step by step progression ie 250 to 600 to open but then this is not necessarily going to be right either as there will be some, like Diesel who rip straight onto a 900 and do fine while others will get onto a 600 and shit themselves. I think you have to rely on the individual to assess this one for themselves.

I would dearly love to see some sort of continual education process, not necessarily focussing on riding skills, but certainly to address attitude, defensive riding skills etc. The thing that disturbs me most on the road is sitting behind a younger rider who has gone through compulsory training not too long ago but who has clearly tossed the Roadcraft Lecture right out the window. It's a simple 1 hour part of the course which isn't difficult but usually gets totally ignored. Refreshing it after getting some real world experience I think would help a lot. Keep a look out for how many riders keep a safe buffer in traffic or go to set up going through intersections. I'm tipping you won't see many.

[Felix]

...I would dearly love to see some sort of continual education process, not necessarily focussing on riding skills, but certainly to address attitude, defensive riding skills etc...

This is actually what I mean when I talk about further training...it really should have less to do with the physical skills as it does with the whole concept of using the road system safely, and recognising the factors that affect us on the road, especially the fact that we have so many substandard roads.

Anyhow...

[Glen]

My opinoin, make rider training and track days more affordable.
Have track days incorporate additional training. (they use to).
Have them subsidided by the Govn't not run by a high profit motivated organisation.
The NSW govn't own Eastern Creek raceway and they lease the track out to a single track day / training operator who was the highest bidder for the tender. Its obviously about profit not rider education...
They've even made it so there is no competion to keep prices down..

Absolutely Dave.

They've done the same with compulsory training. The company that wins the tender is the one with the lowest price not necessarily the best facilities/instructors/record. What happens then is that the Rider training organisations pay instructors shit, expects them to wear the law suit when a student sues and provides less instruction to "force" students through.

Unfortunately some of this we've brought on ourselves. Training on ride days detonated when we started getting sued for people crashing while under instruction. The insurance Co's then wouldn't take the risk and we couldn't afford to take out our own insurance as individuals (nor would anyone cover you). No one would cover us under their policy, not the Ride Day provider, the ARDC, the Govt (track owner).

The deal breaker for me personally was a twat on a ride day who threatened to go me personally because he went out on the track without his helmet done up. Apparently he considered that my responsibility. I threw my hands up in the air, walked out at the end of the day and never instructed again.

[Mizz ZZR]

I love Neka's compulsory "Funeral Plan" idea. Fits in well with the "Oh, so you're a temporary Australian now?"

Maybe Neka should be PM!!!

[diesel]

21 year olds can get themselves into trouble on scooters from what I hear

yeah that tends to happen. smartarse.

u got got a good point there felix and i know it's not a personal attack at me, it's just i enjoy riding fast around corners. and i took the time to learn how to do it properly.

many of the said group, like riding fast in a straight line and can't corner. i just wanna be able to get the chance as the minority in that group to prove i can ride a fast bike and ride it safely.

[Felix]

...many of the said group, like riding fast in a straight line and can't corner. i just wanna be able to get the chance as the minority in that group to prove i can ride a fast bike and ride it safely.

I actually get what your saying, but you need to look at this from the governments perspective. They need to plan a whole bunch of stuff around people using the roads, including how much extra stress it can put on emergency services, hospitals, and so forth. If a group or users stands out as being a big user of these services, what do think they will do? They don't have the money or time to get to know you all personally.

They will make a blanket decision, and that will affect some that don't need to be worried about, but they need to think of the greater good, etc...

I doubt they'd do anything retrospectively, but for riders/drivers of the future, I see changes...

[diesel]

i see what ur saying.
basically they gotta generalise, cos if they make one exception, they have to make many, and that takes too much time/money?

it makes you just wanna go out and race.
but can't afford that. bugger.
anyone wanna sponsor a mediocre rider with a half-decent bike?

[MadKaw]

it makes you just wanna go out and race.
but can't afford that. bugger.
anyone wanna sponsor a mediocre rider with a half-decent bike?

If you ever reach that level, we may consider it....

[Felix]

...cos if they make one exception, they have to make many, and that takes too much time/money?...

Exactly.

But I wouldn't worry if I were you...you'll be ok as things like this wont happen quickly and are unlikely to be retrospective.

[diesel]

it makes you just wanna go out and race.
but can't afford that. bugger.
anyone wanna sponsor a mediocre rider with a half-decent bike?

If you ever reach that level, we may consider it....

or you could sponsor me and coach me.

[aardvark]

Publilius Syrus once said:

"Invitat culpam qui peccatum praeterit "

Roughly translated this means:
"Pardon one offence and you encourage the commission of many. "

Same applies with our traffic laws.