Ethical dilemma

[Cath]

Seraph, it sounds to me that you've made your opinion known to her and she's decided to ignore it.

She sounds like a moron, but it doesn't sound like pictures, discussions of the consequences, etc will do anything, because she's in "won't happen to me" mode. I strongly advise you NOT to throw out her helmet. No matter how 'right' you are, I know I would react violently to someone throwing my stuff in the bin because they thought they knew what was best for me. That's seriously presumptious and condescending. Even though I agree with you 100%, don't go there. All you'll probably achieve is a pissed off friend, and perhaps theft charges if she's really pissed about it.

OTOH, there's nothing stopping you reporting her to the cops. It is against the law to wear a non-approved helmet, so dob her in. Maybe continually getting pulled over and fined may make her change her mind. Hitting people in the hip pocket often works when persuasion doesn't.

[samhasa636]

I can't believe this chic is so vain she won't wear a full-face/decent open-face... I am sure she will be a bloody oil painting after she stacks that scoot at 60km/h and lands on her head.

Tell her to swing by emergency one Sunday afternoon and have a look at what they bring in off the street... car or bike, it aint pretty. If that doesn't do it I am afraid there is nothing more anyone can do.

PS.
Bill Hicks was the funniest farker this planet will ever know. R.I.P

PPS.
Tool are the best farking band the planet will ever know

[Nanna10r]

Obviously your a caring person to be still thinking about & discussing the isssue, n Qudos for that mate.
I pretty much agree with what Glen n a few others have said. I am reknowned n occassionally ridiculed for me "Nana Speeches" on the group rides & in Private. But if it can avoid someone getting hurt lost or Embarrassed then i'd rather people take the Piss outta me then someone else suffer far worse.
I'd have a quiet "nana Talk" to both of them. I wouldnt buy her a new helemt or hide/lose her old one, as this will probably be seen in a negative light. Then i would continue not to ride with them till she gets a decent bug in her eye or up her nose, it should'nt take long for her to have something hit her hard enough for her to see WHY we wear Full face lids. Then i bet they go shopping for a Pretty Helmet n then you will be able to ride with them.
I see someone in shorts n think ..... havent fallen off yet mate ?. No worries you'll get the lesson soon enough n I will give them a wide Birth till they do.
hth.
Cheers Brett

[Zombie]

There are some really good points here and I agree with them all.

Glad to hear that you are so concerned about this, so mant bloody stupid ppl out there.
some points must be made clear to her, if she won't listern to you then you gotts convince your mate and he can nag her.
Commuting is the most dangerous cos there is all the other idiots on the road in cages that dont see bikes.
Tell her that you went riding and 4got to put your viser down/viser broke off and you got flys and mossies in your eyes and teeth and you just bloody glad it wasn't a stone or a ciggy butt. So a full face helmet would stop it happening to her.
Shock tactics don't generally work just see how many of us still smoke after all those campaigns on TV, its down to the "It wont happen to me" syndrome.
I agree most with Cath about not throwing away her helmet.
And tell her it is a legel requirement. Im sure Jas will be able to give you the full 'details' of the law.

Good luck

[kypez]

bah! I'd throw it away!!

or get your mate to do the same... or give her the option. One hand old crapy unsafe one or a nicer safer one!

Be cruel to be kind.

[Phil]

tell her shes a f#%king idiot and show her this

if i didnt have a full face i'd have nowhere to put my goatee

[JamesLaugesen]

I'd tell her and your mate what you think and say clear-as-day that you don't want to be on a ride with her unless she wears a real helmet.

People don't need that on their mind when they're on a ride; sure some riders can ignore it, but you obviously can't and I think it's unfair for you to have to worry about it when you should be concentrating yourself.

I wouldn't go spending money on a helmet for her though unless you can definitely use it elsewhere.
By the sounds of it you might be better off letting her choose her own helmet.

Otherwise you could always set her up for regular run-ins with the police.

Explain to her that she's making a bad imagine for herself, people she rides with and even other riders (depending on who sees her and how the react).
I know someone older like my mother (who grew up in a "racing family") would go absolutely mental at the "stupid stupid girl" (that's what she'd say, haha).

Even downhill mountain bikers where full-face helmets! Geez.

[HemiDuty]

Yeah I would say do what you can to convince her, there are some cool looking fullface helmets out there, and if she is into the whole cruizer thing you can always get one airbrushed with some sorta tattoo lookin thing on it.

[smek]

gonna take a different line to most of the replies ...

non-motorcyclists always seem to be trying to 'educate' us about the dangers and point out the potential consequences (i passed this accident where the rider had no head!) why would you do it too?

she's made the choice, you've prodded gently, in the end it's up to her and i reckon she doesn't want to hear. I'd be pissed off if someone was pushing me into doing something i felt wasn't necessary.

In the end it's not really your place (since you aren't a close mate), her boyfriend on the other hand is the one you should be working through i reckon if you want to get it drilled in what sort of risk she's taking.

show her my helmet and she'll change her tune on open face lids (edit: meaning how cool they can look, not how nasty they look after an off)

[idh959]

...and if all the other advice doesnt work, just smack her in the face and tell thats only a small part of what it will feel and look like when she kisses the paintwork of a car that decides to pull out in front of her.

[Mojo67]

I think a common ride ettiquette is when someone does something unsafe on a ride, especially if it endangers other riders, they get a "quiet word" and if they don't behave they don't get invited again. Thats what I'd do here. You've told her the facts and she's made her choice. I wouldn't ride with her.

You could also print this thread out, with the pics.

One thing that did intrigue me in this thread. She thinks a full face is ugly but she's on a cruiser???

[Barrabob]

ughhh cruiser riders come from a diferent planet mostly so she would probably go for a open face, take her down to the yam shop at enogera and you will probably find something there in the under 100 bucks range thats adr compliant.

You may find out on riding with her that she nearly stops and pushes the bike around the corners for fear of the bike leaning over and other silly things like that.

I remember on one ride i went of with a bunch of cruisers on my 250 someone got up and told us about brake fade just as we where about to head down the back of glourious lol.

Well maybe they arent all like that but some of the ones I have been on rides with where.

other than that you have to rely on the old peer group presure and point her at the lid department.

[Smitty]

tell her shes a f#%king idiot and show her this

if i didnt have a full face i'd have nowhere to put my goatee

and
I will support Phil
my missus would be missing a fair bit of her face after
contact with the freeway at 75-80kmh
one dead helmet....one alive attractive pillion

[seraph]

Heh, thanks for all the great responses... really got me thinking. I have directed my friend to this thread so he can read it and give me his opinions, and the opportunity to veto any actions I decide to take, since it's his lass, and her responsibility... really, I'm just interfering from the periphery.

Will let y'all know how this pans out, unless of course it turns out to be a horrible mess (of her face or my friendships) in which case I may steal a premium fuel truck and run away to become a hermit, riding the hills pondering existential thoughts with my trusty ZZR250 and my full face helmet until I run out of juice, or break somehting I can't fix with electrical tape. Or I run out of electrical tape.

Cheers -J.

[seraph]

Actually that sounds really good ... I might just do the hermit-with-bike thing anyway See you all later, then...