Kawasaki Sportsbike Riders Club - Australia - Online Forum

Had an argument today with a mate that had done a few track days, he was carrying on about weight on pegs & body position etc but he never once mentioned Counter steering.... I tend to almost overuse it even to the point I move my hands out to the bar ends for more leverage, so I after trying to convince him that he should listen what I am saying I sent this to him to prove a point

a counter video

Waiting for the crash

I use counter steering bugger all really, should practice it a bit more, might be able to ride half decent then

PS. I consciously countersteer.

dilligaf wrote:a counter video

Thats all good and well BUT he is going down a hill most of the time and is not excelerating around any of the corners
and if a bike has no forward propultion it just falls to which ever way you transfer your body weight , so when excelerating
and riding a bike under normal conditions you need to physicaly push the bars ( counter steering) to get the bike
to turn more responsively.

My 2 cents

It sounds like he has a cruse control, he is probably one of those the stunt guys that likes to stand on his bike in the Jesus position

I love this topic ! It always gets some excellent opinions out there - many valid, and a lot of shit as well...

I have heard people tell me that it is *impossible* to steer a motorcycle without any handlebar input, and using only body weight........then I ride past them on the Black Pearl, with the 'Fast Idle' turned up......the bike idles at around 1600rpm.....and in top gear, this gets me running along at 40-50kmh............and I can just lean back and steer that bike basically wherever the hell I want......90deg corners not withstanding. ....and to put this into perspective, this little routine has been normal now since 1981 on the Pearl !

This generally blows the argument out of the water - when the non-believers can actually see a motorcycle steering with *NIL* input to the bars - but only with a shift of bodyweight. It works. It always has.

Practicing counter-steering is easy - just find a nice sweeping l/h curve, and take the left hand off the bars.........you will find out real quick, how much you have to pull the right-hand bar towards you, in order to initiate and hold, a sweep to the left..... good practice for newbs.

so do you CS thru the corner or just at the entry to set it up? I couldn't get past the mindfuck of turning the opposite way to the corner when I tried it.. guess it'll be awhile b4 I can have another attempt at it too :/

you c/s to tip in to the corner, and you 'hold' the c/s all the way through it.

You don't even know you are doing it most of the time, but the practice through a l/h sweeper with the l/h off the bars, will really open your eyes up to just how much pressure you have to put into your only steering hand, to pull the r/h end of the bars back towards you, in order to turn left.

Normally, with both hands on the bars, your left hand is pushing forward, so the effort is halved. With no left hand pushing forward, you have to 'double' the pressure with your throttle hand.......

It is a really interesting thing to try out. Find a sweeper, doesn't have to be fast, in fact a 60kmh bend is perfect.

ok cool

I think the hard part for me will be to be able to do it without having to think it thru

dilligaf wrote:a counter video

See what happens when a car pulls out in front of him.
Makes me think of team America "it's me it's me!!!"
"I think he's saying kiss me kiss me"
"farking smartass!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92d1xtjX ... re=related

Wattie wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92d1xtjXf8E&feature=related

GARY? GARY?

That video and all arguments here neglect the part of Keith's video where he says that even when you do shift your weight, that creates a counter steer action on the handle bars, so holding your weight around the corners like he was doing, would hold the bars in the counter steer position.
Still not convinced you don't need any bar input to turn the bike. Sure you could without any input from your hands, but shifting your weight provides input to the bars.

Some light reading on 2 wheeled dynamics, for me its interesting, as I enjoy the geeky shit (science, physics) but i think if you read through these articles you would end up having a different point of view about your turns next time you get on your bike

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countersteering
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_an ... e_dynamics
http://obairlann.net/reaper/motorcycle/ ... ering.html