Kawasaki Sportsbike Riders Club - Australia - Online Forum

A few people of late, have been bandying about used bike values sourced from the red Book (or others). As someone with over 20 years experience in this industry, I thought it might be prudent and possibly helpfull, to share some information on this resource, which may encourage a more liberal use of the product.

The information contained in this book is more often than not, completely irrelevent to actual values of car/bikes in the market at the time. There are a few reasons for this.

1. The market changes on an almost daily basis. as most are aware, market forces can alter values significantly and immediately. Prices are based on demand. High demand forces prices up, low demand causes some price rationalisation. So, as an example, a new model being released, could cause an influx of trade-ins. eg- Kawasaki release a new 2007 ZX10R, which is lighter more powerful, bettter handling and just sex on wheels-so some of the 04/05/06 10R owners start upgradeing! This causes an influx of used 10's on the market, thus reducing the saleability. This can happen within hours and days, not weeks and months!

2. The information they utilise to estimate values is at best flawed. They according to industry sources, utilise advertised prices from classifieds around the country to form part of their estimation. (and as we all know, we ALWAYS get the price we are asking for our goods don't we? )

3. The dealer feedback utilised to ascertain the values, is as far as I am aware limited to one or two M/C dealers across the country! So the core sample is too small to gain any accurate picture.

4. the information, by the time it is gathered, collated, printed, and distributed, is 3-4 months old!

5. Market alter from state to state. As an example, check out used bike prices in QLD as compared to Vic during winter. You will find the Vic market stalls more in winter.


There are numerous other factors also, but I hope I have made my point clear. Just to add some weight to my information, I have copied the "red Book" Disclaimer for you to read. How they can get away, with providing a resource, which they even claim is inaccurate, incorrect, irrelevent, unsuitable and unreliable (their words not mine-read below) I will never know!!!!!!!
"The Red Book" DISCLAIMER - LIMITATION OF LIABILITY
To the extent allowed by law, Automotive Data Services Pty Ltd hereby : declares that it does not give any warranty, whether expressed or implied, as to the accuracy, correctness, relevance, suitabliity or reliability of any information contained in this web-site.


Here is an actual real life example of what I am talking about.........

Red book listing;
2001 E2 Kawasaki ZX9R
Trade in price guide* $6,500 - $7,700
National average price - private sale* $9,000 - $10,600
Price when new (RRP) $17,290

Last night I went and had a look at another ZX9R for a friend. It was an 01 with 27K and a full service history. After negotiating with the seller, he paid, $7000 for it, with 6 mnths rego, brand new tyres, and a RWC supplied! Somehow, I think the Red book/Glass Guide etc are way off the money. And if you read the disclaimers, they even make you aware of it!!!!!!

Marty
correcto...

but can I add-
2 rules when dealing with buying/selling bikes

caveat emptor...buyer beware
caveat exigo....seller beware

Dealers use Redbook (or Glasses) value when it suits them
on tradein values or setting selling prices!
the private 'sale' market seems to be more representative
of the 'correct' values of bikes.

one other thing I have noticed over the years....
bikes reduce in value to a point and if kept in good nick
never go below this value point!
(but if not in good nick..become nearly worthless )


hth

cheers

I was told they also use the transfer values. You know, when you write on the rego transfer papers how much you *really* sold it for.

Yeah well said smithy

buyer beware

thats great if ya know what ya lookin @

in my case no fu^%#! clue

so after a some discussion with strka during a ride

he had offered to help in purchasing a replacement

for my written off zz600

and in fact marty actually found the bike as well

so it was with some confidence

that i was able to go forward and purchase a great bargain

with marty


with in minutes he had sized up not only the buyer

and the bike after some consideration and negotiations

i am now the proud owner zx9

for the sum of $7k

a big thank you marty
for your paitence and time
not to mention your knowledge


so marty i can pop over most sundays to wash and vacum your vehicles



thats if you can get me off the 9


mick

Strika wrote: And if you read the disclaimers, they even make you aware of it!!!!!!

Many know it's just a "guide" It's not gospal, but is something to help start you search on.
Same as parousing bikesales/bikepoint to get a rough idea on what a bike MAYBE worth.

The true price is what you sell or buy it for

Oh and 250's always seem to be dearer in VIC due to no LAMS here.

Strika wrote:.....Somehow, I think the Red book/Glass Guide etc are way off the money. And if you read the disclaimers, they even make you aware of it!!!!!!

Couldn't agree more. I have always thought the Red Book 'guide' was more like a wish-list for eager sellers......

Smitty wrote:...biikes reduce in value to a point and if kept in good nick never go below this value point !

And some models continue to rise in value ......about 10-15 years ago, you could still buy a good condition Z1000 for under 3 grand. That was about the lowest point in the cycle. Z9's and 1000's are now averaging about 6k-8k for a 'good' condition model. They will only continue to appreciate in value. Gotta luv a Z

WC Fields "I think said it " correct me if I'm wrong

P. T. Barnum.

I'll buy the 2004 zx10r when they're $8 grand Looking at how they depreciate would 2-3yrs from now be reasonable ? There was an ebay sale for $10 grand already! The problem is how much will the 6 be worth by that time

javaman wrote:I'll buy the 2004 zx10r when they're $8 grand Looking at how they depreciate would 2-3yrs from now be reasonable ? There was an ebay sale for $10 grand already! The problem is how much will the 6 be worth by that time

well funny u should ask.

a 04 636 are going for about $12k and the 04 10r are getting the same or less. Go figure.

At the end of the day redbook is a guide and doesnt take into account haggling.

I could by a 10r for $5k, but it doesnt mean anyone can. Someone else might be happy with the advertised price.

As with everything you buy 2nd hand its all about how good the thing has been looked after and maintained.I even think thats more important than milage.If you had 2 bikes,same type year etc and one had 10k but looked like it had been not looked after and serviced and the other had say 25k but was in great condition,and both were the same price,i would tend to go for the higher milage good condition one.
Its like when i sold my busa,i bought it from a shop and paid $12,500 for it with 35k on the clock and when i sold it 2 years later with 78k one the clock,i still got $11000 for it because the guy who bought it could see that it had been looked after and maintained well.Same goes for the viffer i had,paid $7000 for it with 28k on it and sold it 2 years later with 57k on it and got $7500 for it.Its all about presentation when selling.

Will the single-cast engine of the 10R will be an issue in the long run ?

Longevity has more to with desirability than reliability, unless it is a BMW.