Kawasaki Sportsbike Riders Club - Australia - Online Forum

remember where they are and don't speed past........

image shake re: telephoto lenses use a mono or tripod....problem almost solved..although some what inconvenient

fireyrob wrote:

photomike666 wrote:If you only plan to use your pics on your computer, or prints will never be much over 5"x7" then any lens will suit. If you plan A4 plus prints, then higher quality lenses is recommended.

In time I definately want bigger pictures / prints posted on the wall around home. So yeah a decent lense is essential. What numbers (ie scale range) should I be looking for in the f rating and quick auto focus? To give you an idea Ill be taking happy snaps of rugby, bikes, cars etc so moving sports!

Ok, I just wrote a long reply and it got deleted by a crash :/

basically, I would go with a good quality mid-distance lens like my 70-200.

cheap lenses can be good also however. the photo below was taken with my cheap 50mm 1.8 but the one below was taken with the 70-200. (both photos were taken during an open day for the new super-hornet)


I would steer clear of the smaller players eg Sony, simply because of the attachments.

with a Sony camera you are limited to the very few lenses, flashes etc that they have.

this may change in time, however at the moment thats just the way it is. If you know you will be happy with the accesories that Sony have then thats fine though.

also with the 2 big boys you know people will have spares, lenses you can try out at events like superbikes, etc etc.

my 2c.

Neilp wrote:.....................

If your into action shots you need to also look at the different methods the lens manufacturers handle image shake very important when using zoom lenses!


Neil

the Sony a200 comes with a ' Steadyshot' feature/mechanism for use with longer lens to reduce shake
one reason I bought it

fireyrob wrote:

photomike666 wrote:If you only plan to use your pics on your computer, or prints will never be much over 5"x7" then any lens will suit. If you plan A4 plus prints, then higher quality lenses is recommended.

In time I definately want bigger pictures / prints posted on the wall around home. So yeah a decent lense is essential. What numbers (ie scale range) should I be looking for in the f rating and quick auto focus? To give you an idea Ill be taking happy snaps of rugby, bikes, cars etc so moving sports!

Foc us speed is not generally an issue. Money is generally spent on the large apertures. The bigger the whole, the more glass required, the more expensive the lens. The top lenses have a mirror and lens system that allows the aperture to remain constant through the full length of the lens. These are the really expensive ones.

A Sigma/Tamron 70-210 lens may cost $300. when set to 70mm, the maximum aperture will be F4, but at 200mm the max aperture will reduce to f5.6. This will require the shutter to be open twice as long in order to capture the same amount of light.

A more expensive Canon 70-210 lens may cost $700, with the same aperture range but will have higher quality optics.

The next step will also be 70-210mm with an aperture of F4-4.5, but the lens will have image stabalising and the price will be $1100.

Image stabalising is worth it's weight in gold if hand holding the camera. As you're hand moves, the camera moves accordingly. The longer the lens, the more exagerated the movement. Go too slow on the shutter speed and the shake blurs the image. The general rule is the shutter speed matches the lens length. If you have a 50mm lens, your shutter speed needs to be shorter than 1/50th of a second. If the lens lenght is 200mm, the shutter speed needs to be shorter than 1/200th of a second. An image stabalised lens compenstaes for some of the shake, and allows you to use slightly slower shutter speeds without the shake bluring the image.

also worth noting is that most digital cameras do not use a sensor the same size as a 35mm negative, and all lens lengths are based on the 35mm dimensions. What this means is that the digital sensor sits within the 35mm dimensions, and give a slight 'zoom' effect. It's about 2/3 of the size, making a 100mm lens = 133mm. This needs to be taken into account both when buying lenses, as it distorts what you think you are getting and in setting you shutter speed so you do not get camera shake.

In old 35mm terms, a 50mm lens gave the equivalent perspective of the human eye. Shorter than that, and it became a wide angle lens, and you didn't need to go much shorter then 22mm. In digial terms a 35mm lens is equivalent perspective to the human eye, and wide angle lenses are sometimes shorter than 17mm.

A quick bit on lens length. In film terms, the lens length is a measure in mm from the front of the lens to the actual camera film behind the shutter. This does not account for magnifying optics, only optics to focus the light.

However, a lens physically 17mm, or even 800mm would be unuseable or unbuildable. So magnification optics are included to keep the lens length sensible. We use the mm term as a reference to judge a lens magnification ability.

insane wrote:
I would steer clear of the smaller players eg Sony, simply because of the attachments.

with a Sony camera you are limited to the very few lenses, flashes etc that they have.

this may change in time, however at the moment thats just the way it is. If you know you will be happy with the accesories that Sony have then thats fine though.

also with the 2 big boys you know people will have spares, lenses you can try out at events like superbikes, etc etc.

my 2c.

sorry you are wrong...the list of add on lens/accessories for a Sony goes for pages (one reason i bought the Sony..lots of extras available)
plus
they bought the Minolta camera business** 5 odd years ago... so previous Minolta lens fit (plus of course the usual Sigmas
Tamrons etc with Minolta mounts) Also they use Zeiss lenses eg 85mm 1.4, 135mm 1.8, 16-35mm 2.8 in their range of additional stuff!

I have a very good (read also expensive Minolta film camera from my days with a photo club) and Minolta made some of the finest cameras and lenses
back then ...again a reason why i decided on the Sony (which is based on what they got at Minolta)

Overall .......value for money the Sony hit the right spot (and remember I spent a lot of time talking to camera sales people before I decided)

one further thing and not widely known...Sony make the sensors used in pentax and Nikon cameras

cheers

Smitty

**Konica Minolta went broke in 2004 I think it was and Sony bought the lot

the kid wrote:

fireyrob wrote:There's a few happy snappers around the site and some decent one's too

OK so Im wanting to buy a good Digital SLR! But what to get???

Just a thought , maybe some of the excellent photographers on here could tell us the details of what camera , lens and settings they used for taking a particular shot .
Would help a photo numpty like me

Best piece of equipment you can get is a $10 fluro vest - they'll get you anywhere! Then you don't need a large lens to get into the action.
Film used to be cheap so I used lots of it, but memory is cheaper so I use shit loads of it. In this one weekend trackside I took over 1600 images and still had memory to burn.

I'd say go with Canon/Nikon/Sony, and comparitive reviews like at dpreview are great.

If you can get better lenses from the start (ultimate I'd say f2.8/4 zoom for bikes and a prime lens (or a 2.8 small zoom not as nice but more versatile) family shots.

and a cheaper camera body

you'll take better photos in more situations and won't need to upgrade as quickly than the other way around.

The camera and sensor technology is so good now in slrs it's the lenses which are the limiting/liberating component.

Here was our approach.

Around 2 years ago we spent about $2k on pro 2nd nikon hand gear worth probably .... ooo $6000 rrp and we'll probably keep it all forever, the camera has taken over 70,000 shots, you can't buy a better zoom, and we've never once considered upgrading while the other in my photography group have all gone on to spend at least another $2-$7k on top of their original purchases in the same time.

damn it... I had just typed up a big reply aswell and damn laptop keyboards, the back button and 1am in the morning!

In short my reply had to parts...
part 1: Nikon and Canon have good names for a reason... professional photographers prefer them for a reason. Stand on the side of a race track and count how many use anything other then a Canon or Nikon. Professionals do not buy camera's based on name, they purchase them on experience.

part 2: (any sales people here don't get offended) Sales people as a general rule know crap all about the product they are selling (atleast in the technology sector), it is by there job to know how to talk anything up. Especially the likes of Dick Smiths, they generally hire people who don't know anything about the products (I have met a couple that really did know what they were talking about). Do not take anything a sales person tells you for granted. You are much better of reading the reviews and doing the feature comparison's on the dpreview site. The guys that do these reviews are experts in the field, they do full reviews on all the camera's and they actually understand what each camera's capability/drawbacks are.

And now you ask yourself (that was the short version :p) I think I am lucky it crashed or I would have been red carded for sure lol

Buy whatever camera Wobbles uses , just look at those FANTASTIC action shots

as above you can almost count the spokes in the first shot that is quick........................ (shutter speed)

the kid wrote:Buy whatever camera Wobbles uses , just look at those FANTASTIC action shots

That'd be a

Pentax K100D Super
Taken at ISO 200
F4.5 and F5.6
93mm 120mm and 150mm

now tim looking that the file properties is cheating!

I have a Nikon D100 and am looking to get a Olympus Pen E-P1 for our big trip across the drink.

link1,link2,link3.
It's not as popular, but they've started an open 4/3 standard which seems to be taking off and has Sony amongst the fold, so it's off to a good start.

Update

I had a couple of people ask me what Ive done on this... The advice given was incredible thanx all!

After much indepth reading I was still a little confused. I didnt previously post but this is a gift to the Mrs now we have a young'un. Her old film SLR was destroyed and I thought it best that she get an option and thus I ruined her surprise

The bulkiness of the SLR's is the major issue so we've gone for a decent compact. Was about to fork out for the Canon Powershot G10 but now will hang out for the G11

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0908/09081908canong11.asp

I think its a great combo of a compact esp hauling childrens crap around to a half decent lens etc. The SLR can wait for now and any change I get for my $1K will be put towards trackdays

Thanx all once again!!!