Kawasaki Sportsbike Riders Club - Australia - Online Forum

Glen wrote:Lots of bike in, body out ie keep your body straight, the bike pushed down and your head turned. If it's really tight remember your slow riding from your license test, ie back brake, slip the clutch a little and keep the revs up.

Practise tight circles ie like your doing a U Turn

I am really worried that people are advising others about slipping the clutch when riding on the open road. Using the back brake, yes for sure but apart from doing a 10km an hour tight u-turn why would you need to use the clutch? It just really isnt neccessary and just adds another factor into the equation when people should be concentrating on taking a smooth line and looking through the corner.

Even taking the tight hairpins on Macquarie pass, Jamberoo Road, Brown mountain, Clyde mountain et al I have never known anyone who has resorted to this technique.

The only time I have ever used the clutch on hairpins is on my fully laden VFR on the heavily rutted dirt roads through Wollemi NP. Mind you I have never seen a hairpin tighter than a signposted 15km/h IIRC

Glen wrote:

Nucci wrote:Ok on my experience I would say that advice is just down right stupid..

Not necessarily so. If it's a really tight hairpin ie the 5k corners on Galston Gorge this is precisely what you should do. It's like a Uturn, slipping the clutch will help keep everything smooth and combined with some rear brake and a few revs will keep the bike fairly stable.

It's all in the learners and P's course

If its a 5km hour hairpin then it goes without saying you should be using this technique, but are we talking about riding on trails or on the road? And if so I would like to see pics of these sealed corners as they sound like a goat track

Nucci wrote:I am really worried that people are advising others about slipping the clutch when riding on the open road.

I think we're talking about different beasts Nucci. The hairpins on Galston Gorge are about the same radius as a poorly performed U Turn, so the technique we teach learners and P platers is pretyy well what will get you through them best. I presume your talking about 25 - 45km/h hairpins which you clearly wouldn't use your clutch in (unless it's the slipper clutch coming into them )

burkys_ninja wrote:Tackle them at your own pace, make sure that you are totaly focused and over time you will get the hang of them.

for some reason right hair pins i cant do properly but left handers are no problem

And its on sealed road? Ok, nope never come across hairpins like that in my time on the open road, and hopefully wont have to

But are these uber tight hairpins the same type Collette was referring to? Because if she is talking run of the mill ~25km/h hairpins on the open road then I would still say keep away from the clutch.

Glen wrote:

Nucci wrote:I am really worried that people are advising others about slipping the clutch when riding on the open road.

I think we're talking about different beasts Nucci. The hairpins on Galston Gorge are about the same radius as a poorly performed U Turn, so the technique we teach learners and P platers is pretyy well what will get you through them best. I presume your talking about 25 - 45km/h hairpins which you clearly wouldn't use your clutch in (unless it's the slipper clutch coming into them )

Running too quickly into the downhill right-hander before Wiseman's Ferry on your first ride out there ain't no fun either

Clutch use in all situations is a personal thing, BUT it REALLY controls the drive dont it ? You can rev the bikes tits off with clutch in and it aint going no where. Stating the obvious I know but it leads to this. There is lots more postions than in and out (calm down you sick buggers ) and it gives different amounts of drive same as throttle position, if you have been used to using it, old 2 stroke MX bikes for example, it is 2nd nature, same as using the throttle. What everyone is saying is right
SOOOO what I am saying is, if you are comfortable with the clutch, use it, if not dont. But becoming friendly with all its possibilities is obv to your advantage, just maybe not in this situation.
Either way you look as far through any corner as far as you can, the vanisihing point. Hairpin turns are obv the worst of this truth. Get out in a carpark with some witches hats or substitutes and practice. When you do go up there dont just go through once, go back several times, get comfortable with the corner. Get off the bike, walk it, have a look at it from different angles, try different lines.
Some like to just turn their head, some their head and point the shoulder and some love being monkeys.
Chances are you also tense up knowing its coming an all, which just makes it worse (from experience)

frogzx12r wrote:Clutch use in all situations is a personal thing, BUT it REALLY controls the drive dont it ? You can rev the bikes tits off with clutch in and it aint going no where. Stating the obvious I know but it leads to this. There is lots more postions than in and out (calm down you sick buggers ) and it gives different amounts of drive same as throttle position, if you have been used to using it, old 2 stroke MX bikes for example, it is 2nd nature, same as using the throttle. What everyone is saying is right
SOOOO what I am saying is, if you are comfortable with the clutch, use it, if not dont. But becoming friendly with all its possibilities is obv to your advantage, just maybe not in this situation.
Either way you look as far through any corner as far as you can, the vanisihing point. Hairpin turns are obv the worst of this truth. Get out in a carpark with some witches hats or substitutes and practice. When you do go up there dont just go through once, go back several times, get comfortable with the corner. Get off the bike, walk it, have a look at it from different angles, try different lines.
Some like to just turn their head, some their head and point the shoulder and some love being monkeys.
Chances are you also tense up knowing its coming an all, which just makes it worse (from experience)

I know where youre coming from dude, but still it detracts from the basic premise that your entry speed should be set before you enter the corner (Yes I know that isnt always possible), so unless you are travelling at such a slow speed that you need to be slipping the clutch to maintain that entry speed you shouldnt be touching the clutch at all through a corner. There are cases where it needs to be done but it should be pointed out that this is the exception not the rule. And a very remote exception at that (I am guessing there is probably 10 corners on sealed roads in the whole of australia that would require such a technique)

Mick C wrote: I love them...it's the downhill righthanders that make me a bit nervous.

I'm with you. Going uphill you're on the throttle so the bike is balanced and will handle nicely, plus all you have to do to slow down is let off a little. Best advice I can give is relax. If you're thinking how much you hate doing the turn that's coming up, you're probably going to be all tense and the bike won't be able to turn the corner because your stiff body won't let it. Relax.

The wises words ever spoken...

'Don't Panic'

oh, and relax, you're there to have fun...

Nucci said "your entry speed should be set before you enter the corner"

Agree 200%, its was more to maintain that corner speed and drive. Some of the roads I have ridden are little better than MX tracks (and I like that) so I dont suppose some MX technique goes astray. Also I tend(ed) to use the clutch and back brake a lot (more than I think I did) on a ZX12R to do the same for different reasons. I had just learned to cover the clutch a lot and it worked for me.
For anyone confused I am not talking about pulling the clutch in, just letting a little of the "drive" out as it where (does that make sense?).
I "feel" it takes the "peaks" off. I know it sounds a bit touchy feely but its the only way I can think to put it.

Just for the record I prob wouldnt reccomend it unless you were already used to it, that corner is not the place to "try it out". I was just trying to put a different and (I hope) explanitory view on it that may have helped others to understand what was meant. My advice was to practice THAT corner a lot until it did fell good, it may take time and lots of riding up and down a nice road by all sounds, bummer eh?

Ride over to Adelaide, I'll take you to the Cork Screw and run you through a few training drills that'll have you over your fear of hair pins in no time.

In the mean time, remember:

Gutter to apex to gutter.
Head up and look through the corner.

Nucci wrote:I am really worried that people are advising others about slipping the clutch when riding on the open road.

I beg to differ. Using the clutch mid corner is a great way to settle the bike and it's also handy if you've gone in a gear too high.

Egg Zacahary
and if you read the above the funny bit is I never (well hardly) use the clutch when upshifting.

Well it seems that there a few schools of thought on the matter, but yes Aardvark I have to say I disagree with you as far as 'using the clutch mid corner is a great way to settle the bike'.

If I go in too hot, I will try and lean it over more, maybe trail the rear brake a wee bit but most of all make sure I dont ease off the throttle. I never want to decrease my drive using the throttle but keep it easy. Ive even used a bit of front brake to tighten my line as the 10r seems happy with that too if need be.

But im happy to agree to disagree on this matter, horses for courses

mohawk miss wrote: I hate hairpin bends, to be precise, left uphill hairpins.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle them, I just cant seem to get the hang of them

Don't apex too early on uphill hairpins, its an easy mistake to make.

Normal hairpins ( not those Galston Gorge ones ) should be taken at posted speed or a bit less if you are not familiar with the road / surface.

Keep the throttle opened, don't shut it off completely.

Get the bike upright as soon as possible after the apex, and get on the gas. - in an appropriate fashion of course.....

Find a shitty uphill hairpin, and ride it over and over again for 15-20 minutes. Your technique will improve *on the spot*.

Galston Gorge hairpins - take them slowly, they are some of the worst I have experienced.

Nucci wrote:....I am really worried that people are advising others about slipping the clutch when riding on the open road

Slipping the clutch on the open road is an accepted method of immediately increasing speed without changing gears, and can save your life when overtaking a line of traffic / semi-trailer / road-train . It is also a great method of additional throttle control in shitty situations. It should *not* be used when apexing corners, fair enough, but hells bells, giving the clutch a big *faaaaaannnnn* on the way *out* of a corner is the best way of jumping out of a slow corner as quickly as possible.

We are riding sportsbikes here, not 250 commuter bikes !!!