Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:32 pm
We are each responsible for our own actions, but something organised should have basic rules.
I know many dealers only require what is required by law. I took a ZX7R for a test ride last year, and one of the shop guys lead me round. Another guy also came along, testing a brand new CBR1000RR Fireblade. He had denim jeans, bike boots, casual jacket and no gloves. The dealer guy knew this and set a blistering pace, which included himself getting fully locked up splitting lanes to an intersection.
Also, prior to the accident you mention witnessing her cornering technique, did anyone point out her flaws and offer advice on correct cornering?
I know many dealers only require what is required by law. I took a ZX7R for a test ride last year, and one of the shop guys lead me round. Another guy also came along, testing a brand new CBR1000RR Fireblade. He had denim jeans, bike boots, casual jacket and no gloves. The dealer guy knew this and set a blistering pace, which included himself getting fully locked up splitting lanes to an intersection.
Also, prior to the accident you mention witnessing her cornering technique, did anyone point out her flaws and offer advice on correct cornering?
Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:42 pm
At the end of the day, IMHO it the the riders responsibility.. So long as someone has told her at some point in time the down falls of not wearing the gear then it is a case of learn the hard way.
As far as licensing goes, it really is a load of crap in Australia..
When you approach the 3 lights you either turn hard left, right, or stop. Or ride along at idle between the lines (Only really good for lane splitting)..
But at the end of the day you pass in a carpark.. he's your cert.. go ride in the traffic...
Why doesn't licensing atleast involve some portion of riding on the road... Just because someone can do the easy stuff out in a car park, does not mean they have the ability to go and do it on the road... Taking corners, staying in your own lane, obeying real life road rules with other vehicles, etc are all things you have to do on your first day out on the street.
IMO, it should be say 2-3 days course... You must pass all the general current stuff and be technically licensed, but unless you can then pass the on the road portion, of obeying the road rules, etc then you fail and have to resit that portion.. How many people get their bike license and don't even have a car license... You have to have driving atleast 120 hours in Vic supposedly to get your P's, yet on a bike you don't have to have riding 5minutes, so long as you can manouver the bike in the car park.. It seriously is a Crock of shit IMO... And they wonder why so many young people get killed... Lack of experience...
Even if they incorporated this in co-operation with an insurance company which cost you $100-$200 more, but gave you good deductions for bike insurance.
As far as licensing goes, it really is a load of crap in Australia..
When you approach the 3 lights you either turn hard left, right, or stop. Or ride along at idle between the lines (Only really good for lane splitting)..
But at the end of the day you pass in a carpark.. he's your cert.. go ride in the traffic...
Why doesn't licensing atleast involve some portion of riding on the road... Just because someone can do the easy stuff out in a car park, does not mean they have the ability to go and do it on the road... Taking corners, staying in your own lane, obeying real life road rules with other vehicles, etc are all things you have to do on your first day out on the street.
IMO, it should be say 2-3 days course... You must pass all the general current stuff and be technically licensed, but unless you can then pass the on the road portion, of obeying the road rules, etc then you fail and have to resit that portion.. How many people get their bike license and don't even have a car license... You have to have driving atleast 120 hours in Vic supposedly to get your P's, yet on a bike you don't have to have riding 5minutes, so long as you can manouver the bike in the car park.. It seriously is a Crock of shit IMO... And they wonder why so many young people get killed... Lack of experience...
Even if they incorporated this in co-operation with an insurance company which cost you $100-$200 more, but gave you good deductions for bike insurance.
Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:53 pm
I tend to avoid group rides for this reason. I don't see why my day should be ruined by someone who hasn't enough sense to protect themselves, someone who does something outside their abilities, or why I should ride with a bunch of people I don't know who aren't prepared to care for others (legally required or otherwise).
Wed Dec 28, 2005 1:05 pm
As I have only had my L's for about 4 months...maybe 5, I know my own skill level and I don't push myself when riding with others. My mates all have bigger and faster bikes than my ZZR250 and when they decide to go a bit harder then I let them go. Lucky for me I haven't felt the hard surface scrapping away my dignity and hopefully I can keep it that way. I think everyone should be responsible for their own actions but if must try to push it harder then you should definately make sure you have all the necessary safety gear and kick yourself in the arse when things go pear shaped not try and find a scapegoat.
Wed Dec 28, 2005 2:08 pm
There was a lengthy conversation with her at the cafe we stopped at regarding riding technique. But she either didn't get what was being said or did the typical teenage thing and denied there was even a problem.
As much as i hate being a pesimist, i can't help but feel her attitude will earn her a place on the road toll. I hope i am wrong.
As much as i hate being a pesimist, i can't help but feel her attitude will earn her a place on the road toll. I hope i am wrong.
Wed Dec 28, 2005 2:53 pm
I-K wrote:Felix wrote:Remember, it isn't defamation if it actually happened
Er, actually, it is.
Queensland Justice wrote:Defamation laws
On 9 November 2005 the Queensland Parliament passed landmark defamation laws that give effect to an agreement by the States and Territories to achieve uniformity in the civil laws of defamation.
The model uniform laws, which were developed under the auspices of the Standing Committee of Attorneys-General, end a 25-year impasse during which the States and Territories have tried, but failed, to resolve their jurisdictional differences.
The new laws are designed to strike a balance between protecting individual reputation and the right to free speech. They include a range of reforms to promote the speedy resolution of disputes and shift the focus from costly court trials.
If a person who believes they have been defamed decides to pursue the matter in the courts, the time limit to bring an action is reduced from six years to one year (or three years if the court is satisfied an action could not have been brought within one year).
Ultimately, all defamation actions should centre around finding speedy and appropriate remedies for people whose reputations have been damaged.
Damages for non-economic loss has been capped at $250,000, which is in line with personal injury claims. Courts will continue to be able to award full recovery for economic loss.
Other key features of the legislation include:
* preventing corporations (other than non-for-profit organisations or small businesses) from suing for defamation, addressing current community concerns that large companies could stifle legitimate public debate by beginning defamation action;
* establishing a defence of 'truth' to replace the previous defence of 'truth and public benefit';
* abolishing the awarding of exemplary or punitive damages in civil defamation proceedings; and
* limiting juries to determining whether a person has been defamed, leaving the awarding of damages to judges.
It is anticipated that the new laws will come into effect on 1 January 2006.
The new laws replace legislation that has been virtually unaltered since it was adopted in 1889.
The States and Territories have agreed to enter an intergovernmental agreement to maintain uniformity in making future reforms which will ensure that our defamation laws continue to develop in tandem.
You can view the Defamation Bill 2005 on the Parliamentary Counsel website.
Wed Dec 28, 2005 3:01 pm
Introduce her to KSRC.bigtez wrote:There was a lengthy conversation with her at the cafe we stopped at regarding riding technique. But she either didn't get what was being said or did the typical teenage thing and denied there was even a problem.
As much as i hate being a pesimist, i can't help but feel her attitude will earn her a place on the road toll. I hope i am wrong.
I will screw...I mean talk some sense into her.
Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:43 pm
my skin is that thick from the amount of unjustified harrassment i recieve , i could ride naked !!!!!!!!!!! not that i will ..........unless you ask !
let each to their own and since we live in a democracy let all the nay-sayers get @#cked
fabio
let each to their own and since we live in a democracy let all the nay-sayers get @#cked
fabio
Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:53 pm
I hope this doesn't put the young lady off. Please pass on our best & tell her to come out with Janelle & I when the bikes fixed. We have continued with the quiet "non posted newbie rides" recently.
and what is up with pontikat doing unposted newbie rides ?
since when did he get made god of KSRC ..........?
brett your arrogance is truly wonderful to behold !
fab
Wed Dec 28, 2005 7:55 pm
MadFab wrote:my skin is that thick from the amount of totally justified harrassment i recieve , i often ride naked !!!!!!!!!!!
COOL - does this mean we can now refer to you as Lady Godiva ?????
I reckon Brett's idea is a beauty, and good on him for taking on the task.....all some people need is a bit of help in the early days, and they will be better riders for it, and *hopefully* not become a statistic...
Wed Dec 28, 2005 9:06 pm
MadFab wrote:unposted newbie rides
do tell too....I am a newbie...got my R's on my licence today
Took my bike for it first thrashing....which wasnt really a thrashing, just accelerating faster than I had before. I need to go for more rides, plan on it next monday I think...I might go myself though, just because I am shy 
Wed Dec 28, 2005 9:11 pm
i am pissed orf that pontificate is doing them unposted!
what the fuck is up with that ? is it his private little glory hole ?
or is it so that the newbies all stand around in awe of him !
when the people that they could & should learn off i.e. hammer or greenmeanie , are kept out of the loop !
this is not a personal grudge , i just believe that people should be allowed to make up there own mind .
this is almost a form of club censorship .
rides under ksrc should be posted on ksrc ...full fucking stop
fab
what the fuck is up with that ? is it his private little glory hole ?
or is it so that the newbies all stand around in awe of him !
when the people that they could & should learn off i.e. hammer or greenmeanie , are kept out of the loop !
this is not a personal grudge , i just believe that people should be allowed to make up there own mind .
this is almost a form of club censorship .
rides under ksrc should be posted on ksrc ...full fucking stop
fab
Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:07 pm
Hey, Fab, how are ya?
I take this to mean that there are no "rides under KSRC."
Further, if Pontikat wants to ride with friends (or others) who happen to be newbies, what obligation is there for him to post a ride here? Even if they're all members here? Even if those rides are a regularly scheduled event?
Say I want to go for a ride with Pontikat. Should I post "QLD: Ride to x, y and z," or should I just say, "Hey mate, you off today? Let's go riding?"
MadKaw wrote:Just a note, in addition to the discaliamer posted by RG, please be aware KSRC do not have organised club rides. The rides posted to KSRC are organised by the members not the "club"... The club is merely used as a base for ppl to contact each other... if you get my drift...
I take this to mean that there are no "rides under KSRC."
Further, if Pontikat wants to ride with friends (or others) who happen to be newbies, what obligation is there for him to post a ride here? Even if they're all members here? Even if those rides are a regularly scheduled event?
Say I want to go for a ride with Pontikat. Should I post "QLD: Ride to x, y and z," or should I just say, "Hey mate, you off today? Let's go riding?"
Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:21 pm
Unposted rides may make others feel, "hey I'd have liked to ride today if I'd known about it". But the whole point is to offer newbies the chance to ride without quicker people setting the pace. There is nothing to stop others organise such rides, or from joining in said rides as guides.
I for one would have loved for an experienced rider to show me the ropes first time through the twisties, and I think that it is a harder task if people are hooning the same stretch.
I found our recent photoride to be a godsend as well. To take a corner, thinking you're low on the bike are really leaned over, to see a pic that shows how much further you can go is really educational.
I for one would have loved for an experienced rider to show me the ropes first time through the twisties, and I think that it is a harder task if people are hooning the same stretch.
I found our recent photoride to be a godsend as well. To take a corner, thinking you're low on the bike are really leaned over, to see a pic that shows how much further you can go is really educational.
Thu Dec 29, 2005 8:13 am
My point is that, in context, these rides may have nothing at all to do with KSRC. Why post 'em if that's the case? A remark about getting a newbie to join Brett and Janelle on a ride gets turned into "Brett's bad 'cos he should post his entire riding life on the site?" *chuckle*
And, yeah, I also think it's good for new riders to be shown the ropes without the quick lads around. Regarding Fab's comment that greenmeanie or hammer would be more appropriate teachers, I respectfully disagree. I reckon they'd be bored witless on a newbie ride. Speak up if I'm wrong, fellas.
And, yeah, I also think it's good for new riders to be shown the ropes without the quick lads around. Regarding Fab's comment that greenmeanie or hammer would be more appropriate teachers, I respectfully disagree. I reckon they'd be bored witless on a newbie ride. Speak up if I'm wrong, fellas.