Kawasaki Sportsbike Riders Club - Australia - Online Forum

I do not ride that fast, but definitely much faster than a year ago when I first got my bike. Stacked it once (rider's error) and completely lost confidence and rode very slowly since. Well things gradually changed and today had a quick ride to the spurs and walhalla and I am taking corners at 140-160k. More than once my boots scrape the road. It is thrilling and I no longer feel the fun at lesser speeds

So what are your experiences? How do you guys differentiate skill from pure luck ? I mean I actually now believe it is ok to step on gravel on the road. Where do you draw the line and stop increasing the pace ?

Its all good fun till someone loses a eye, i wont tell ya whats right and whats wrong but the coppers will.

With luck and you being in victoria I think they only take your licence for a month but in QLD they will have it for 6 months for 40kph over even if you where on a empty 4 lane wide section of highway.

The other thing that you mention is things beyond your control like gravel and silly motorists doing u turns, with practice you seem to be able to come out of gravel patches at speed shiny side up and thats a result of plenty of riding time and you come good by reflex.

The only other thing is its not the speed that kills ya its the sudden stop when you hit a tree/car/armco railing/ 6wire well strained barbed wire fence so if there are any of these and you fark up and hit one at 160 kph you will be a mess.

But hey your right at least you had fun doing it.

At the end of the day you have to decide for yourself whats responcible and make your own decisions, I think we came to those conclusions in a diferent thread.

Andi
..interesting question
and
the answer is not so simple
why?
having confidence in your riding skills is one thing..a good thing
but as i see it... the problem lies in the future, the unexpected, the unforseen
do you have the ability to ALWAYS avoid the guy on the wrong side of the road?
the kid that comes out behind the school bus? the branch that drops on the road?..or the drunk driver?
my guess is no...
and my experience is 'no' too.

As I see it...
When you get to the point where you look at whats next
you have 3 choices....
keep pushing the envelope (and await the inevitable )
or
get off the road and get on the track (ask Simmo for example)
or
maintain the current level of skill/excitement

With the last choice the problem of course is that you are human
and as such we are fallible
look at junkies..start on cannabis a bit of grass, maybe try a bit of coke
for that 'just wanna try it' kick and then a bit more coke..a bigger hit
and then heroin..for a bigger kick and more heroin more often
and sadly the results are not good
and
some riders are like junkies..they keep pushing it!
bigger bikes, faster speeds and they either get caught and lose the licence
but nothing changes when they get it back until an accident occurs
or they realise the track is the place for that adrenalin you get when you ride
or they keep it all under control on the road

mate
the choice as I see it..is yours

Me?
I choose to do track days to get rid of the silly stuff in my head
and then keep it under control on the road
(btw..the same applies to my car driving)

my 2c

cheers

Firstly, I don't claim to be an expert but I have experienced similar. Not only with twisties, but also getting through peak hour traffic in London.

London was a case of, if you're nearly as fast as a courier, you're way too fast - they have a life expectancy of 1 year.

As for the twisties, it's easy to keep pushing hard. There are 2 factors, those that you are in control of, and those you are not.

The drunk may hit you at 60k as much as 160, no control over that. But who decides how late you brake, or how early you get on the power? You do.

There is a school of thought that considers most accidents in the twisties to be caused by over confidence, particularly in the braking zone. So what if you were to reduce this danger? The philosophy is to maximise apex speed, while taking the straights at a similar pace. No harsh acceleration, no harsh braking. It's easier to set up for a corner, you won't out brake yourself and there's less chance of a high side on the way out. Save pushing corners really hard a track that has a run off area.

Just my 2c

*edit - spollings

Yeah I also reckon the track is the place to push it. More and more I am reluctant to go on fast road rides. The track is just so much safer. And even it is risky. Going 250+ kph holding a set of handlebars is never going to be terribly safe, so all you can do it maximise your chances of survival. I hear that avoiding wet tracks on slicks is a good start....

if your scraping your boots, you need to hang off the bike more, or adjust the levers


nothing wrong with giving it a little curry, so long as its 'safe to do so'

I'm with Hemiduty on this one, if you want to go faster and faster take it to the track.

You can work on your road/race craft and avoid smacking straight into that car chucking a u turn across double white lines.

The track is so much fun too.

after hitting the track i couldnt be arsed riding for a week, little alone riding hard... certainly gets it out of your system, and sounds like your in need of it.

As i see it there comes a time when every rider has to make this decision.

To really push hard you should be on a Track of some sort. Or at least go to the track to Do courses & learn & develop new skills.

Road & Track Riding really are 2 completely different set of Skills. Certainly a lot of it crosses over but I know track riders who cant ride on public roads for various reasons & i know road riders who will either end up at the track or not riding at all.
The important thing is minmising the risk for the amount of enjoyment you require.

Of course the Choice is yours Andy, but either way mate it sounds like A Braking & cornering Course is due. Money well spent.

Cheers Brett

As others have said. The track is the answer, although you tend to find going for a track day means your next road ride tends to be a little more spirited.

Maybe it comes with age and responsibilities (financial and social) but in many ways I'm over going flat stick on the road. Don't get me wrong I'm as up for a quick blat as anyone but I actually find now I get a lot of fun out of pushing it a bit but concentrating on smoothness, lines etc rather than dragging my knee around corners (a habit which you really need to think carefully about on the road I should add).

Just be careful, the problem is not necessarily with you but the other knob on the road who you have to avoid

Is that Walhalla near Erica?

Yeah push it a little at a time, you will be fine

I am in the same boat, and this is much of the reason I chose the VTR over (for example) a ZX9R. The twin is spectacular fun at low revs and as such you can enjoy the twists and turns in 80km/h zones without fear of instant license disqualification, and without the 'breakneck' upper midrange and top end there is no real urge to get "stuck in" and bring up huge speeds between corners.

I have seen an article about "the pace" which is about smoothness and consistency through corners, without shooting between them at top speed.

If you aren't accelerating hard out of corners you can't highside or pick up the wheel unexpectedly and tankslap off into oblivion.

If you concentrate on accurate cornering rather than braking with full force, then you don't risk locking up, you won't unsettle the bike by picking up the rear wheel, you can't miss the braking point, and you always have the safety margin of the brakes if you do need to reduce your speed more than you expected (eg. debris or the rozzers).

Your tyres will last longer, your bike will last longer, you're less likely to have an off, and chances are your license will stick around a bit longer too. I can ride like this by myself, but find when riding in a group that adherence to the speed limit is frowned upon and is cause for argument. All you need to do is find a group of people who want to ride the same way and you're set.

Thanks guys... really good advise there. I guess it's all commonsense but we know how hard it is to think commonsense when fully-leaned . I always ride with reserve regardless and not riding 10/10... but part of the problem is from time to time the pace increase with the same reserve. So let's say 5 months ago I ride with reserve at 80k, now I ride at much higher speed, still with reserve!

But one thing is so true and inevitable as smitty mentioned: I will come to my limit one day and that extra 40k will decide the outcome So thinking clearly now, I'm not really looking forward for someone i.e. police, or worse something/some event to tell me I could've gone bit easier.

So yeah starting next year I need to find more ways to enjoy riding at legal speed (looking at scenery more maybe ) and that's my new year resolution I guess. I'm back to java for the next month so I'll have a vespa to practice on

faster i say.

javaman wrote:So what are your experiences? How do you guys differentiate skill from pure luck ? I mean I actually now believe it is ok to step on gravel on the road. Where do you draw the line and stop increasing the pace ?

Yep very good question Mr Java

When you find yourself spinning up the rear on roundabouts in the wet for fun or 2 wheel slides on the white lines in the dry then it's time to hang your head in shame

Best known cure is to ride a postie bike for a month....after that you won't need to go quite as 'hard' for the same fix

Damn we're all just junkies aren't we