really obscure question

[98ninja]

ok i was reading stuff on the net/watching old gp highlights and i came upon this question to ask . i didnt know where else on the net to ask so here goes.
after doohans massive stack at assen in 94 honda decided to make their nsr500 more rideable by bring in the big bang firing order. it was down on power but more rideable. so doohan went on winning races and titles and setting records. until 1998 when a few guys (biaggi,criville) started to beat mighty mick. then honda changed doohans bike back to the original firing order to add power but make the bike a bastard to ride. ive read in several places that this was a major factor in his career ending get off in 99. NOW comes the question. rossi in 2000 and 2001 what firing order was his nastro azzuro nsr500? the old bastard of a firing order? or the big bang version?

[Glen]

until 1998 when a few guys (biaggi,criville) started to beat mighty mick.

Wash your mouth out laddy.

I'm sure someone will know the stats better than me but I'm pretty sure the Biaggi wanker never finished ahead of the great man in any race that Mick actually finished. As for Criville, the man who's career was characterised by the phrase "second is good for me today" seemed like a reasonably competent chap but never really resided on Planet Doohan.

Rossi's bike I think was a bigga banga, although no doubt he would've had a play with a screamer. The old screamers sure were good to watch though

[NovaCoder]

I think the Yammy started as non-bang back in the day but by the time Mr Rossi got his hands on it, she was banging like a good un'

[98ninja]

why did he got back to the old firing order then?
ive heard most of the gp bikes today are big bang.
yeah i just wondered whether rossi rode the unrideable or not

[aardvark]

Biaggi only ever won 2 races on a NSR500, in 1998, and the following year he went to Yamaha.

He beat mighty Mick at Suzuka at the start of the 1998 season.

And, if my memory serves me correctly (which it normally doesn't), Rossi was riding the the "Screamer" version of the NSR in 2000 and 2001, rather than the Big Bang version. I'm sure someone here will correct or confirm that.

[Jonno]

I am probably wrong with this but didn't Rossi come up from dominating the 250's in the late 90's and Gardner told him/world he would do no good particularly as he was a tear ass and wouldn't be able to control the massive increase in power after Rossi walked into the 500's and said I will win everything in this class as Iam Rossi and Iam great!
(which really got up Gardners nose)
Well he went away for a while then came back after being brutally punished by the 500's. Must have been after or about the time Doohan retired. All I can recall was Gardner stinging Rossi's tail as he left with it between his legs for a year or so, dunno if it was Rossi tho' but kind of fits.

[Glen]

Rossi got it right the first time.

His record is impeccable. In every class he spent one year learning and the next year winning. In 2000 when he was "learning" the 500 he came 2nd in the championship after winning only two races.

Gardner, while very good at what he did and undoubtedly one of the ballsiest riders to mount a 500, unfortunately made a bit of a name as a connosieur of sour grapes.

[Jonno]

Yeah I was not sure if Rossi went away or became down to business and was out of the spot light, all I can seem to remember was here was this flashy kid and then nothing then all of a sudden here he is again winning everything. I lost interest for a while after the Great Mick D retired
Put it this way we were spoilt having Gardner the Doohan then nothing

[I-K]

ok i was reading stuff on the net/watching old gp highlights and i came upon this question to ask . i didnt know where else on the net to ask so here goes.
after doohans massive stack at assen in 94

That was in 1992. 1994 was the year Doohan won his first title.

honda decided to make their nsr500 more rideable by bring in the big bang firing order.

Don't quote me on this, but the big-bang firing order might go a lot further back than that; like, to 1987 or so.

until 1998 when a few guys (biaggi,criville) started to beat mighty mick. then honda changed doohans bike back to the original firing order to add power but make the bike a bastard to ride.

That's making it a bit too dramatic. Reverting to the screamer layout was Doohan and Jeremy Burgess' idea, conceived part as a headfuck for the rest of the paddock and part as a response to the switch to unleaded fuel which came into effect at the end of the 1997 season. The unleaded fuel made the engines more docile, whatever their firing order (it's what killed the Honda NSR500V twin customer bike), meaning the extra power of the screamer no longer came with the same increase in power delivery harshness as before.

ive read in several places that this was a major factor in his career ending get off in 99.

Put simply, anyone who'd write that with a straight face doesn't know their arse from an underseat exhaust.

NOW comes the question. rossi in 2000 and 2001 what firing order was his nastro azzuro nsr500?

Screamer. In 1998, Doohan was the only one on it. By the end of 1999, the whole field was running them, and that continued until the end of the two-stroke era.

[I-K]

I am probably wrong with this but didn't Rossi come up from dominating the 250's in the late 90's and Gardner told him/world he would do no good particularly as he was a tear ass and wouldn't be able to control the massive increase in power after Rossi walked into the 500's and said I will win everything in this class as Iam Rossi and Iam great!
(which really got up Gardners nose)
Well he went away for a while then came back after being brutally punished by the 500's. Must have been after or about the time Doohan retired. All I can recall was Gardner stinging Rossi's tail as he left with it between his legs for a year or so, dunno if it was Rossi tho' but kind of fits.

Rossi came into the 500's as the reigning 250 champion in 2000. He lowsided out of the first race, highsided out of the second, came, I think, eighth in the third, about fifth in the fourth, ran around just off the podium for a few more rounds, then got his debut win at Donnington a couple of months later.

Now, bugger me with a red hot poker, but I can't, for the life of me, remember whether he'd got a podium before then... anyone wanna search MotoGP.com?
(yes, all of the above is from memory; that whut-whut-whut sound is my anorak rustling as I walk)

[98ninja]

ok cool this is the kind of response i wanted. all my info is peiced together from online and motorbiking magazines. first motogp season i really watched was 2004. i read that he had a crash in 99 that he couldnt come back from. a highside at 200+. im not sure on it.
yeah also same article i read that the screamer version headfucked the opponents because of the lines of rubber and smoke his competitors saw on the exit of the corners.

[Jonno]

I am sure that Rossi turned up prior to that for a very very short while, before Doohan retired, then again I am not totally convinced of my memory or the facts.

[Tack]

While your all talking about motogp and stuff.....not meaning to hijack the thread....but seeing that motogp has moved to 4 strokers ...do you think it would be better and more reflective of modern biking to move the other classes to something more appropriate...like maybe have a 400cc 4 stroke class instead of the 250cc s stroke and maybe a 250cc 4 stroke class instead of 250cc???

I mean, how many people ride 2 stroke road bikes?

[Steve_TLS]

That's making it a bit too dramatic. Reverting to the screamer layout was Doohan and Jeremy Burgess' idea, conceived part as a headfuck for the rest of the paddock

That was it.

Anyway - here's a list of 500cc / MotoGP race winners from 1949 - 2005 http://www.europark.com/ny-gpdat/ny-pw500.htm

[aardvark]

I asked Jeremy Burgess about the how 2-stroke thing for the 250's and 125's. He said he couldn't see them getting rid of those two classes for some time yet.