Stoner to race V8's

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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby s man » Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:10 am

When we were invited to race the 2+4 at the creek, I couldnt believe the crap they went on with, they are so up themselfs I dont know how they breath. {not all, but most] We went out on the bikes & they were gobsmacked, they never seen anything like it, they thought we were mad. I thought they are soft. I did a stint in cars in the mid 2000s & i can tell you theres nothing hard about it. Spoilt brats... :lol:
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby Tack » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:15 pm

I dunno that all V8 drivers, or some of the smarter engineers, think that bike racers are stupid. Quite a few of them love to get out on their own bikes at tracks and have a go. Whenever there's a MotoGP on plenty of V8 people want to get home to watch it and when there's a 2 + 4 on with them plenty of V8 people follow and help superbike riders that are their friends.
You may not like V8's, the racing or their people but you have to respect what they've done. In a small sponsorship market (Australia) where high profile sports (Football codes and cricket, etc) all compete for the meagre number of big company sponsorship dollars that exist here, they have excelled. They have achieved the profile, the media coverage and the financial positioning in a tough market against dominant Australian sports.
It’s a huge problem here. We just don’t have the population or large numbers of wealthy companies to support all the sports we have. What determines support here is obviously TV and other media coverage.
What the people behind V8’s have done is taken a floundering but iconic sport and moulded it into a marketing and sponsorship success.
That’s all V8’s is; An Entertainment Franchise. A Reality TV sports show. A business.
Boxed, wrapped and packaged for TV with the sole aim of allowing its franchise members the leverage to attract corporate sponsorship for an extremely expensive sport.
Each team employs companies to track every piece of media coverage they get and the estimated value in return for their sponsor plus the overall value that V8 supercars gains in the overall market place. The cost/ benefit ratio being how much money/value the teams can generate in coverage compared to how much the company can spend through direct advertising in the media or in other sports if they left V8s.
The top V8 drivers are almost TV celebrities, appearing on TV shows, advertising and making appearances at stores etc. They are household names and the category has entrenched itself as a an iconic Australian sport.
This is mentality that bike racing here needs to adopt do to get itself out of the bushes and support lower categories and riders and especially with the added bonus of being able to produce and support more world champions overseas.
The disappointing part is that bike racing can be so much more exciting and competitive than most forms of car racing however that’s not the point is it! Australian bike racing has more World champions than car racing does, plus a long and proud history of very successful riders and engineers on the world stage, probably far more than Australian car racing does. But what difference does all that make. It’s really about money, sponsorship dollars, market share, TV coverage, profile, marketability, value for investment dollar, share holders etc.
That’s what Formula One did under Bernie Ecclestone, It’s what V8 Supercars modelled it on, it’s what NASCAR is all about and it’s what MotoGP has been trying to achieve.
The real question is: What is Stoner doing wanting to drive in a category that embodies and is the pinnacle all the things that he supposedly despises about the direction that MotoGP is heading ?
I live with fear everyday but on weekends she lets me ride.
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby Strika » Mon Jan 28, 2013 5:03 pm

Oh Tack................. Typical of you to come in here and spoil everyone's BS with facts and rational thinking.......We'll have none of that thankyou....... :)
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby Tack » Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:34 pm

Lol strika yeah I know but I do understand the sentiment that people have about the whole thing.
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby s man » Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:28 pm

There were only a few V8 there, it was a combined meeting, sports cars open wheelers, the lot. Still up em selfs all the same..
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby Naked Twin » Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:58 pm

s man wrote:He wont tow the company line, so expect the drivers to give him a touch up when they get a chance, they already know he will give it to them. It will be like when Gardner went to V8s, they all thought this bloke wont worry us, but he did, & they touched him up as much as they could untill he just pissed off out of the series.
I cant see it being any different with Casey. Ive raced at a the old 2+4 meeting & even did it again in 2011. The car guys are all up themselfs & think bike racers are just dumb fucks that dont know any better.I cant wait to see the carnage .


Don't mind generalisation do we. Some of those also ride bikes btw ;) I could make such generalisations about the old triple challenge, or all Harley riders are crims, but that really doesn't serve a purpose

Gardner was and still is the biggest knob to ever don a helmet. He got touched up because he expected respect, it is earned not handed out, anyone who says I thought I had better to come to Eastern creek as it was built because of me is a wanker. Yes quoted from him at the Father's Day muscle car event.
Last edited by Naked Twin on Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby Tack » Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:00 pm

I'm not a Gardiner fan but I don't dislike the guy either. Like it or not he was a tough determined gutsy never give up rider and he was a World champion. He's probably said some pretty egotistical things over the years as well which didn’t help his likability and , if you were to speak to people like Doohan about Gardiner, he would tell you how bad he behaved when Doohan started to look the goods in MotoGP, you probably think he was a bit up himself. Burgess said he was a heart on his sleeve type of guy and I would have to agree. I had a to work around Gardiner occasionally for a few years in V8s and I saw a man that was utterly determined to succeed, who threw millions at it and was extremely frustrated by his lack of success and therefore got pretty angry at times.
The thing is I don’t think that Gardiners lack of success in V8s is a direct reflection on Gardiner’s driving ability. I reckon it’s an interesting comparison and a major difference between car racing and bike racing. If you were to talk in percentages, I would guess that probably 90% of the performance/speed/success in car racing is the engineering of the car which depends entirely upon the engineers/technicians/builders/mechanics and brains that you have in your team. Most of that talent is bought with the most money and/or degree of prestige that working for that team brings (eg everyone wants to work for Farrari, Williams, McLaren or HRT, 888 or Honda, Yamaha or Ducati works team). If you have the best people, smart people, with a great team manager and good team structure chances are that you will produce an extremely good car capable of running at the front. The last 10% is up to the driver and his ability to steer/adapt/muscle the thing around.
You may not agree with me but I have seen many many many times a grid that goes (for example) $140,000 car on pole, $120,000 second, $100,000 third and so on down the grid. You can’t tell me that driver ability had much to do with that unless by some astronomical cosmic coincidence you think the best drivers spend the most money.
In comparison, in my opinion it takes far more human input to ride a bike at the limit and therefore a bike riders percentage of performance and the overall a bike riders ability that makes the difference. I dunno what percentage of rider ability adds to the bike percentage as a total maybe the better riders here can judge that but I think it’s the reason you see such a big difference between the top riders and the rest.
So, in my opinion, Gardiner wasn’t a bad driver at all and his lack of results was more to do with his “team” and car performance than him. His captain kaos nick was more to do with trying so hard to with a not as good car.
Stoner is going to have the best car in the development field with a more level playing field than Gardner had AND STONER IS with the best team in V8s.
I live with fear everyday but on weekends she lets me ride.
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby Naked Twin » Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:44 am

Gardener only has himself to blame with regards to equipment when he ran V8s, it was his team put together by him. Thus his success/ failure was his and nothing else.

Great racer who made it to the top the hard way, but that doesn't excuse being a wanker
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Re: Stoner to race V8's

Postby MickLC » Wed Jan 30, 2013 8:27 am

One of the big issues with the local bike championships when compared to the V8's is that the V8's are a goal, whereas the bike series' have just been a stepping stone.
How can they build a fan base when the best riders disappear overseas at the earliest opportunity? It's only the lack of money internationally that's keeping some of the riders here now so hopefully they can take advantage of that.
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