Problems with the Surfer

[MickLC]

OK, I'm trying to work out what's going on with the Surfer and it's doing my head in.

After about 6 or so months sitting in the corner of the garage, I pulled the head off and with Gos's help put in some new valve seals and gave it a tidy up to clean up all the burnt oil out of the exhaust ports. Put it all back together, after fixing a total of 16 threads that were either already stuffed or went on reassembly, gave the carbs a quick clean and fired it up.

Took it for a test ride and it initially seemed OK, then would just bog down a bit at around 4,500rpm then get past that and rev out to around 6,500rpm where it would bog down again and not go any faster without a lot of coaxing and misfiring. A new set of plugs didn't help at all.

It seemed to be pretty independant of throttle position, so after triple-checking I hadn't stuffed up putting the cams back in by comparing the timing marks to the photo I took before pulling it apart, I figured it must be an ignition system problem. I'd been wanting to chuck on a DynaS system for a while to replace the GPZ electronic ignition it had, so I ordered one with new coils and leads.

I finally got that onto it the other weekend and took it out for a spin. It was a little fluffy around 5,500rpm, then hit 7,500rpm and it was like hitting a rev limiter, again independant of throttle position. Just to be 100% sure I pulled the carbies off on Sunday and gave them a complete going over, making sure everything was clean and clear. Put them back on, took it out again and the same problem is still there. I also put on a new fuel tap as the old one has had a leak since day 1 and it had turned up during the week, but no difference.

It idles beautifully and blipping the throttle will get it revving nicely. The advance unit isn't sticking and I even swapped it out for a spare one with no change. I've triple-checked the timing on both coils. I tried running it without the pod filters and it got worse. I checked voltages at the coils and they're all good.

The only other thing is it's running on 95 and it's always been a bit more partial to regular 91, but that's getting impossible to find these days without ethanol in it. Just in case I tried advancing the ignition a bit to compensate for the octane and it made no difference either.

I'm sure it's going to be something stupid but I just can't work out what it could be.

[Strika]

If it got worse on pods, then It's pointing towards mixture issues. Now what is causing that? I would recheck the jets to start. Sometimes just a narrowing can mess the mixture enough to make it break down or reduce revs. Also check air screws.

[MickLC]

It seemed to get worse when I ran it with no filters on at all, but it was overall worse, not just at the problem revs. I've run the pods for years with the current jetting and also confirmed the main jets are spotless. They've had more carby cleaner and compressed air through them than fuel lately

[MickLC]

....also checked air screws and their galleries are clean and adjusted properly.

[Strika]

Not something really silly like a kinked fuel line or blocked tank filter/inline filter.

[Gosling1]

its just jealous of the shiny new Zed in the corner !

Have you changed the old coils over to new Dyna coils ?

Might have to re-check the cam timing as well .....

[MickLC]

Not something really silly like a kinked fuel line or blocked tank filter/inline filter.

Nah, I chucked a new fuel line on it and it has a nice clear run. It also got a new fuel tap on Sunday so it's clean as a whistle.

[MickLC]

its just jealous of the shiny new Zed in the corner !

Have you changed the old coils over to new Dyna coils ?

Might have to re-check the cam timing as well .....

Dunno why, it's had more weekend loving over the last month

Brand new Dyna coils went in.

I've checked the cam timing two times, both to what the manual says and the photo I took before pulling it apart.

[photomike666]

It almost sounds like an intermittent inlet air leak between , how's ya rubbers?

[Gosling1]

.....Dunno why, it's had more weekend loving over the last month

Brand new Dyna coils went in.

I've checked the cam timing two times, both to what the manual says and the photo I took before pulling it apart......

hmm OK.

When you first took it for a spin - it had the old electronic ignition and coils, and the problem rpms were 4,500 and 6,500. Fitting up the Dyna S and dyna coils moved the problem rpm up to 5,500 and 7,500 ? is this about right ?

Sounds like you have the cam-timing right.....what about the CCT ? Is this new ? Could be time for an APE manual tensioner.

Next things I would be checking are valve clearances and carbie balance - just to make sure these are all in spec. and we can tick them off.

[davo231481]

so..... did you sort out this issue?

[MickLC]

Not a 100% no, it's still a bit fluffy at full throttle around 5-6000rpm, but otherwise it cruises along nicely.
I'm just living with it for now.

[oldman]

Usually if you have a compression problem or have the cams mis-timed the problem is just fluff throughout the rev range or a real shitty idle. It sounds like you did something to the carbs when you "cleaned them". Check the plug insulation colour and see if your running lean or rich.
You are making the typical mistake I make and that is I do some work and when I'm done it runs like crap and I chase my tail fixing stuff I didn't work on and in the end I fucked something up fixing whatever I was fixing. It is really sounding like carbs. Cheers!!! Oh Jim Beam will make you see more clearly.